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The Janet Murray Show - Love Marketing, Make Money

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Now displaying: September, 2020
Sep 25, 2020

Are you mystified by YouTube? Would you love some clear practical strategies to get people to watch your videos and get more subscribers on your YouTube channel?

If so then you'll love this podcast episode with YouTube expert Justin Brown. Justin demystifies YouTube and explains what you really need to do if you want to grow an audience on YouTube and get your videos seen by MORE people.

Listen and discover how the YouTube algorithm works (and how you can help te algorithm show your YouTube videos to MORE people).

Find out if subscribers are really more important than views and why keywords should be your number one priority on YouTube.

If you're just starting on YouTube then listen as Justin explains why your thumbnails are so important (and how to get them right), why optimisation is crucial and the five things that you need to do to make sure people stop scrolling and watch your videos rather than someone else's.

{Click on the player above to listen to the podcast episode and/or read on for a detailed overview. Scroll down to the bottom to read the show notes including all the links mentioned in this episode.}

Join my Build Your Online Audience programme Build Your Online Audience programme

Podcast shownotes

 

  • About my 2021 Sorted Annual Content planning event (01:09)
  • What Justin does and how he became a YouTube expert (7:57)
  • Why you need a budget for marketing your videos (10:49)
  • Where people struggle with creating video (12:06)
  • Why you need to create content that people want to see (13:07)
  • Why you should start your keyword research before you create your video (13:38)
  • The three things your YouTube video has to do (15:20)
  • How to approach a YouTube video strategy based on search (20:40)
  • Why keyword research is important for your YouTube video title (24:30)
  • Why you shouldn’t avoid the popular search terms (26:27)
  • How the YouTube algorithm works (27:55)
  • Why YouTube subscriber numbers are a vanity metric (30:39)
  • Why thumbnails are so important to get views on your video (32:02)
  • The five-step video process that Justin uses to hook people in (33:40)
  • How to create a good video experience for people (36:44)
  • How long should your YouTube videos be (38:17)
  • How to make sure that people stick with your YouTube video to the end (39:40)
  • Why your video needs to be clear and concise (40:20)
  • What kit do you really need and why your audio is most important (41:38)
  • Why your first videos won’t be perfect (and how to make them better) (43:58)
  • Why consistency is important and what you need to remember (45:30)
  • How to use your competitor's YouTube videos to research (46:01)
  • Why the first 24 hours are really important for your YouTube videos (47:29)
  • Why you should have a re-optimising strategy for your older YouTube videos (49:40)

 

Resources

 

Justin's website
Justin's YouTube channel
Buy my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner
Join my Build Your Online Audience Programme

Other useful podcasts

 

[Bonus] Should you join my Build Your Online Audience Programme? (podcast)
[Bonus] Should you buy my 2021 Social media Diary & Planner (podcast)

[324] How to stop talking about video and just do it with Dan Knowlton (podcast)
[346] How to look and feel more confident on live video with Ian Anderson Grey (podcast)
[347] How to create engaging social media videos (even if you hate being on camera) (podcast)
[372] How to build an engaged online audience (podcast)

Connect with me on Twitter, Instagram Facebook and LinkedIn

Sep 18, 2020

Do people ever ask if they can pick your brain….but don’t seem to want to pay for it?

If that sounds familiar you need to create a Power Hour - an online consultancy session where you give specific advice/guidance...and actually get paid for it.

The great thing about a Power Hour is that you can ‘productise’ i.e. turn it into a rinse/repeat process that you go through with every customer who books one (saving you tons of time).

You can use a Power Hour as a paid ‘discovery call’ where you deliver value and - if your client seems like a good fit - upsell them another product/service afterwards. And to research ideas for bigger projects e.g. coaching/consulting packages, courses and events.

But how do you choose a topic for your Power Hour? What tech will you need to deliver it? And how much should you charge?

That’s exactly what I’ll cover in this podcast episode - along with tips on how to promote your Power Hour.

And yes, you can create one regardless of whether you have a product/service-based business

{Click on the player above to listen to the podcast episode and/or read on for a detailed overview. Scroll down to the bottom to read the show notes including all the links mentioned in this episode.}

What is a Power Hour?

A Power Hour is an online consultancy session where you give specific advice/guidance...and actually get paid for it.

Contrary to the name - a Power Hour doesn’t actually have to be an hour long. It can be as short/long as you need it to be.  You can call it a Power Session if you like (or something else entirely). The important thing is that you get paid for your advice/experience.

Why I love Power Hours

There are so many reasons why I love Power Hours. Here's just a few:

✔️  They’re a great way to deal with people who ask to pick your brain for free (you can just simply say ‘I’d love to help you with that....here’s a link to my Power Hour’

✔️ You can use a Power Hour as a paid ‘discovery call’ where you deliver value and - if your client seems like a good fit - upsell them another product/service afterwards.

✔️  You can use a Power Hour to research ideas for bigger projects e.g. coaching/consulting packages, courses and events. For example, when I was launching my Instagram Success Academy course, I did a number of Power Hours so I could understand what I should cover in my course

✔️  You can use a Power Hour as a  downsell people for people who don’t have the budget for your high-end offer but still need your help

✔️  You can use a Power Hour to ‘top-up’ coaching programmes/memberships/courses. For example, if a member is being particularly demanding of your time in a Facebook community, you can invite them to book in a 1-2-1/additional call

✔️  You can turn your Power Hour into a rinse/repeat process that you go through with every customer who books one (saving you tons of time)

✔️  You can book clients in for multiple Power Hours for problems that take longer to solve

How to choose a topic for your Power Hour 

The important thing is that you get paid for your advice/experience.

As with anything in your business, the more specific/niche you can be the better. So while you can offer a general Power Hour (where anyone can ask you anything about your expert topic) you’ll almost certainly get more take up if you hone in on a specific type of customer/client and/or a common problem your customers/clients experience.

If you have two or three areas, you can offer a few choices (but not too many).

Here are some examples of effective Power Hours, created by my current/former clients:

Amy Caiger has a Power Hour that focuses on helping business owners find their niche.

Architectural technologist Jon Clayton has a Power Hour for people who are interested in renovating their house. He started charging £195 for an hour on Zoom or £295 for a local home visit. This resulted in £600 of sales immediately.

Diversity consultant Leyla Okhai offers a number of different options including diversity, worklife balance and wellbeing.


Can you create a Power Hour if you have a product-based business?

If you have a product-based business, you can still create a Power Hour. You can either offer something that relates to the problem you solve. For example, I sell a Social Media Diary & Planner. Although I don’t currently do this, I could offer a content planning Power Hour for people who want help creating their content plan. I could offer these sessions to existing diary owners as an upsell. 

Or I could open them up to anyone who needs help with content planning and offer the diary as an upsell at the end of a consultancy session.

Or you could offer a Power Hour to other product-based businesses on how to do something specific that you are already doing successfully but they might be struggling with e.g. creating a marketing plan, setting up a shop on their website.

How to deliver your Power Hour

You can use video-conferencing software like Zoom which allows you to share your screen and participants share theirs with you. You can also share documents and chat ‘live’ with participants. And you can send them the recording afterwards in case they want to go over anything again. Zoom starts from £11.99 a month.

Alternatives to Zoom: Go To Meeting, Team Viewer, Join.me, Google Hangouts, Meet.me & BlueJeans.

If you’re worried your clients will be overwhelmed by the tech, it’s a good idea to send them written instructions and/or a video using a free tool like Loom showing them how to use it (including how to join).

How to ensure your Power Hour is productive

To ensure the session is productive, I’d recommend you do the following:

  • Create a dedicated page on your website for you Power Hour that includes information about the session and a link to book
  • Use a tool like Calendly or Acuity Scheduling so clients can book straight into your diary
  • Send a pre-call email on how to prepare for the session (including any information they might need to bring to the session) and an outline of how the call will be structured. PLUS  instructions on how to use the video conferencing software from their phone/desktop. I’d recommend sending this information immediately after booking, then at least one reminder email before the call
  • Send a follow-up email within 24 hours of the session, with a link to the recording, a short follow-up report with details of what was discussed and up to three key action points (one side of A4 should be plenty).

These emails can be re-used and adapted - saving you hours of time in the long run. In fact, the whole process can be automated so people can book straight into your diary, are delivered the link to join the call and reminders before the call.

I include template/swipe files for these types of emails in my online masterclass: how to create and sell a Power Hour for your business.

If you’re worried that what you teach/coach can’t be delivered online, I’ve personally worked with a pilates instructor, bread making teacher, psychologist, personal trainer and jewellery- making teacher - all of whom deliver their training/consultancy online. And if they can do it, so can you.

How to price your Power Hour

Your pricing should reflect the transformation you can create for your client - not how long it takes you to prepare and deliver the session.

That’s said, you do need social proof. You can’t charge £500 + VAT an hour for a Power Hour if you haven’t achieved results - or helped others achieve results - that support that.

Many of my clients start with £99 to £149 and, as they get more experienced - and get more tangible results - put their prices up.

So start by thinking about the transformation you can create for someone and the impact that could have on their life/business.

It can help to spell out the return on investment for your clients. So for example, if I could give you some advice on your sales copy that would help 5x your investment, would you think £500 +VAT was expensive? Probably not. It’s all about how you frame it.

But you do need to have the experience to match your pricing. You can’t charge £500 + VAT for your Power Hour just because someone else in your industry is doing it (well you can, but you may not make any sales).

So if you haven’t yet delivered any Power Hours it can be worth offering a number of discounted sessions so you can gather testimonials. I wouldn’t recommend offering them for free. People generally don’t value what they get for free. Which means they’re more likely to cancel/show up late to the session and less likely to implement your advice. Even a modest fee will ensure they have some skin in the game.

How to promote your Power Hour

If you already have an email list - great.  Simply email your list, tell them about your Power Hour and (providing you’ve created the right offer for the right audience) you should get bookings. I’d also recommend doing some social media promotion too. If you have a blog/podcast/Youtube channel, it’s also worth sharing information about it there.

If you don’t have an email list (or only have a small list) you’ll need to use proactive outreach. That means making a list of people you know (e.g. current/former clients) who might be interested in your offer. PLUS asking for recommendations/referrals from friends/colleagues. If you’re not sure how to get started with proactive outreach, the first module in my Build Your Online Audience programme focuses on exactly that topic (and includes email/message templates you can adapt for proactive outreach).

Need help building your email list? Check out: 39 Surprisingly easy ways to increase your email subscribers 

I also have an email list building programme inside my Build Your Online Audience programme

Podcast shownotes

 

  • What is a power hour and why I love them (4:22)
  • Why a power hour stops you feeling like you have to give stuff away (6:08)
  • How a power hour helps you decide if you want to work with someone (7:42)
  • How to use power hours to research ideas for bigger projects (08:03)
  • Why power hours are great if someone hasn’t enough budget for you (09:38)
  • How you can make more money using power hours in a coaching programme (10:31)
  • How to use power hours for a specific project (11:34)
  • How to prep and manage people’s expectations (12:50)
  • How to choose a topic for your power hour (14:12)
  • Why a power hour will save you time (17:31)
  • How to create a power hour for a product-based business (18:28)
  • Video conferencing software for your power hour (21:39)
  • How to map out and plan your power hour (22:40)
  • How to make sure your power hour has a good outcome (24:58)
  • Why you should choose a few specific topics for your power hour (26:15)
  • How to price a power hour and what you should remember (27:09)
  • How to use your testimonials to sell your power hour (29:10)
  • How to promote your power hour (31:03)

Resources

 

Buy my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner

Join my Build Your Online Audience Programme
Find out about my How to create and sell a power hour masterclass 

 

Other useful podcasts

 

[Bonus] Should you join my Build Your Online Audience Programme? (podcast)

[339] How to build an audience for an online course or membership (podcast)
[386] The four types of content that will help you make more sales in 2020 podcast)
[372] How to build an engaged online audience (podcast)
[414] How much does it cost to launch your own planner (podcast)

Connect with me on Twitter, Instagram Facebook and LinkedIn

Sep 11, 2020

Are you looking to launch a new product or service in your business?

Or maybe you’ve tried to launch something in the past and it’s flopped?

Find out the secrets of a successful launch in this podcast episode - I’m sharing behind the scenes of my recent launch of my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner and how I made 10K of sales in 24 hours.

Discover the five-step process that I've used for the past five years to successfully launch and presell my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner. Discover how I build excitement and desire about my Social Media Diary & Planner and how you can use this process in your business.

PLUS why building authority is so important if you want to launch a new product or service and why it really does come back to your content.

{Click on the player above to listen to the podcast episode and/or read on for a detailed overview. Scroll down to the bottom to read the show notes including all the links mentioned in this episode.}

Podcast shownotes

 

  • About this podcast episode and why I recorded it (05:01)
  • Why people have to want to buy your product (07:08)
  • Why launching a test offer will help you find out if your product is viable (08:25)
  • What you need to ask yourself if you’ve launched a product that’s flopped (10:41)
  • Why you need to build an audience before you launch a product (11:12)
  • Why it takes time to build an audience (14:10)
  • Why your conversion rate will be higher if your leads are warm (15:29)
  • Why you need to build authority with your content (16:40)
  • Why my podcast makes people realise that my paid-for content is worth investing in (18:03)
  • Why people have to know who you are before they’ll invest in you (18:58)
  • Why a launch is a long term thing and you can’t just rock up online (20:00)
  • Why your launch might have flopped in the past  (20:30)
  • Why you have to think long term with a launch (22:35)
  • How I built awareness for my social media diary & planner (23:48)
  • How I got people excited about my Social Media Diary & Planner (28:01)
  • Why you need a really great product to help build social proof (30:44)
  • How to use scarcity to sell more of your product (especially if you’re preselling)(32:58)
  • How I used Facebook ads to create leads (37:18)
  • Why everything comes back to your content  (38:18)

Resources

Buy my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner 

Find out more about my Getting started with Facebook ads course with Emma Van Heusen

 Join my Build Your Online Audience programme here. 

Other useful podcasts

[Bonus] Should you join my Build Your Online Audience Programme? (podcast)
[Bonus] Should you buy my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner (podcast)

[337] The tools I am using to build my online audience (podcast)
[339] How to build an audience for an online course or membership (podcast)
[386] The four types of content that will help you make more sales in 2020  (podcast)
[372] How to build an engaged online audience (podcast)

Connect with me on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook and LinkedIn

Sep 7, 2020

Are you wondering whether you should buy my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner?

Perhaps you already have a favourite planner and are wondering whether you’d actually use it? 

Or maybe you’re a fan of digital diaries and are not sure how you’d get on with a paper planner? 

It could be that you’ve bought diaries/planners in the past and haven’t used them as much as you hoped (if at all). Maybe you even bought my Social Media Diary & Planner last year and didn’t use it as much as you hoped.

Or maybe you’ve heard about my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner and 2020 sorted

In this podcast episode (which you can also read as a blog post) I’ll help you decide whether to buy my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner. 

I’ll explain what kind of results you can expect if you invest in my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner.

PLUS the difference between my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner and my 2021 Sorted Club. And whether you should invest in the Full On Janet Murray Experience (2021 Sorted PLUS my signature programme Build Your Online Audience programme).

By the time you’ve listened to this podcast episode (or read this blog post), you should be able to make a decision whether to purchase.

{Click on the player above to listen to the podcast episode and/or read on for a detailed overview. Scroll down to the bottom to read the show notes including all the links mentioned in this episode.}

 

Podcast shownotes

  • About this podcast episode and why you might be listening
  • About this special bonus podcast episode  (01:01)
  • About my diary and my other products that you can buy (3:42)
  • How I came up with my social media diary & planner (8:35)
  • How my social media diary & planner can help you (13:17)
  • Examples of social media posts from awareness day (15:12)
  • Why you should be posting personal stories and not business (18:02)
  • How the awareness days will help you create great content quickly (19:21)
  • How the diary can help you think seasonally and plan your content ahead (24:03)
  • How the diary will help you make more money (24:58)
  • Why you have to remember that people want to do business with people (30:01)
  • The specification of the diary (and what it looks like inside) (31:20)
  • About my diary community (and how it can help you with content creation) (35:21)
  • Why you should buy 2021Sorted (34:50)
  • About my special bonus gift (36:22)
  • About my annual content planning masterclass 2021 Sorted (39:01
  • How much does it cost to invest in my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner (43:03)
  • Why there is no right or wrong way to use a diary or planner (44:50)
  • Why writing things down will help you take action (47:08)
  • Why my Social Media Diary & Planner is suitable for any industry (49:44)
  • Why my Social Media Diary & Planner suitable for product and service-based businesses (51:20)

Resources

Not a member of my Build Your Online Audience programme but want to join? Join my Build Your Online Audience programme here

Thinking about joining my Build Your Online Audience programme? Listen to this podcast

[BONUS] Should you join my Build Your Online Audience Programme (podcast)

Other podcast episodes

[339] How To Build An Audience for an Online Course or membership (podcast)
[343] The three audiences you must build to create a successful online business (podcast
[381] How to use awareness day to create engaging content for your business (podcast)

Connect with me on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook and LinkedIn

 

Sep 4, 2020

Are you wondering whether you should be using Facebook ads in your business?

Perhaps you’re worried it’s too early on in your business. Or you’re not sure what kind of budget you need to get started. It could be that you’ve tried using Facebook ads in your business...but didn’t get the results you hoped for.

If any of this sounds familiar, you’ll love this podcast episode (also available to read as a blog).

In it, I share seven signs you’re ready to run Facebook ads (and what to do if you’re not).

PLUS I also answer some of your burning questions about Facebook ads including - how much do I need to spend on ads to turn a profit and is it worth running a Facebook ‘likes’ campaign.

{Click on the player above to listen to the podcast episode and/or read on for a detailed overview. Scroll down to the bottom to read the show notes including all the links mentioned in this episode.}


1. You have a product/service to sell 

It sounds obvious, but paying for Facebook ads is no guarantee of sales.

If you want to make sales from Facebook ads, you need a great product that people actually want to buy. 

Which leads me into point 2...

 

2. You have actually successfully sold that product/service

Have you successfully sold the product/service you want to run ads to? If not, what makes you think people will buy it?

Remember that when you pay for Facebook ads, you’re paying for traffic - not sales.

So just chucking money at ads, is no guarantee of sales. If it’s a poor product and/or you don’t understand how to sell it to your ideal customers/clients, no amount of Facebook ads will help you sell it.

 

3. You need to understand basic marketing and sales funnels

Most people need seven or eight touch points with you before they buy.

Which means it’s unlikely they’ll buy from the first ad of yours they see. They’ll need to get to know you first.

This means you’ll need to build a sales funnel i.e. you need to map out the steps a new prospect might need to take from not knowing about you to becoming a customer/client.

Which might mean running ads to an email lead magnet (a free resource you create to encourage people to join your email list) or hosting a webinar or live challenge in order to help your ideal customers/clients get to know you...then retargeting people who engaged with those ads with your paid offer.

This will almost certainly mean split-testing multiple types of ad copy and creative - because you won’t know exactly what will resonate with your audience until you try.

It will also mean knowing how to install Pixels (tracking code) on your website so you can track your results.

 

4. You know how much it costs you to acquire a customer/client 

One of the most common questions I get asked about Facebook ads is this: how much will I need to spend to make a profit. 

The rather unsatisfactory answer is: it depends. 


There are many factors that influence the cost of your Facebook ads - from the price of your product/service to the audience you’re targeting to your geographical location.

So if you haven’t done Facebook advertising before, it can be difficult to predict how much you will need to spend to achieve your target sales.

Knowing how much it costs you to acquire one customer/client can at least give you a starting point.

Knowing how much you’re currently spending to acquire one customer/client can at least give you a starting point on budget.

Think you’re not currently spending anything on marketing?

Think again.

  • If you’re spending time prospecting leads, reaching out to potential customers/clients and/or hosting discovery calls
  • If you’re spending time creating social media or other content
  • If you’re investing in tools, apps - or even other peoples’ services - to promote your business…

...you ARE investing in sales/marketing

Working out how much you’re currently spending to acquire a new customer/client can be tough - because you’re probably using multiple marketing strategies and not paying specifically for each lead.

But calculating how many hours you’re spending on acquiring new business and/or your total monthly marketing spend (including tools, apps and outsourced services) can give you a starting point.

Dividing these costs by the number of clients/customers you’ve acquired in a specific period can give you an idea of how much it costs you to acquire a single customer/client. And how much you might be willing to spend to acquire similar customers/clients.

Don’t forget to include your time (because time is money).

 

5. You know your ideal customers/clients (and are able to convert them) 

If you want your Facebook ads to work, you have to make sure you’re targeting the right people.

When I hired a new Facebook ad agency recently, I had to fill out a long questionnaire about my audience - not an ideal customer avatar (i.e. fantasy) but information about the customers/clients who buy from me.

To run successful Facebook you need to (a) understand the problem your product/service solves and (b) understand your ideal customers/clients’ pain points.

But understanding your customers/clients is not enough.

You need to be able to create content that really resonates with them and really speaks to their pain points.

So when you’ve successfully attracted them into your funnel (via a lead magnet for example), you’ll be able to create follow up content that will convert them from browsers into buyers.

 

6. You are already creating engaging organic content 

People don’t engage with Facebook ads because someone has paid for them.

They engage because the content is ENGAGING.

So you can chuck as much money at ads as you like.  But if your content is boring…if you don’t know how to write a decent social media post, select/create engaging visuals and/or shoot a decent video on your smartphone - you may as well burn your cash.

And yes, if you have the budget, you can hire a Facebook ads strategist to do all that for you (and make sure you’re targeting the right people).

But if you don’t know how to nurture your audience. If you don’t understand about the buyers’ journey and how to turn leads into sales via your content…your ads will not convert.

So it’s only when you understand how to create engaging organic content - and make sales from it - that you’ll be able to get a return on investment on your ad spend.

So it’s only when you understand how to create engaging organic content - and make sales from it - that you’ll be able to get a return on investment on your ad spend.


7. You need to have a testing budget 

Most Facebook ads strategists recommend a ‘testing budget’ (i.e. a sum of money you’re willing to spend with no expectation you will get it back in sales).

Most Facebook ads strategists recommend a minimum of £300 as a testing budget.

So if you’ve got that budget and you’re willing to blow it on testing, that’s a sign you could be ready to start running ads.

 

What if you’re not ready to run ads?

What if you’ve read this list of signs and feel you’re not ready for ads?

You have two options.

  1. You can hire a Facebook ads strategist. If you have a good product that you’ve sold successfully...they can look after the rest
  2. If you don’t have the budget to hire a professional, invest your time in building an organic audience - particularly in learning how to create engaging content. Then, when the time is right, you’ll be able to invest in Facebook adverts to send more of that kind of traffic your way.

Are you ready to build your online audience? Join my Build Your Online Audience programme here. 

Podcast shownotes

  • About my Getting Started with Facebook ads course with Emma van Heusen (01:53)
  • Why you have to have a specific product or service to sell if you’re running Facebook ads (8:22)
  • Why you have to have sold your product organically before running Facebook ads (10:14)
  • Why audience interests are really powerful for running Facebook ads (12:10)
  • Why you need 7 or 8 touchpoints before people will buy from you (14:05)
  • Why you need to think about the sales journey when planning your Facebook ads (16:12)
  • Why you need to make sure your website is optimised before running Facebook Ads (18:32)
  • Why you should consider carefully the objectives of your Facebook ads  (20:09)
  • Why you need to understand how much it costs to acquire a lead (before you run ads) (22:06)
  • How to work out how much it costs to acquire a new customer or client (23:10)
  • Why you need to understand the cost of your conversions (29:31)
  • Why you need to know your ideal customer or client really well  (33:40)
  • Why your organic content needs to be really good before you run Facebook ads (37:45)
  • Why you need to feel comfortable with an initial testing budget (39:21)
  • What to do if you haven’t built your audience to run Facebook ads to yet (40:08)
  • Why understanding Facebook Ads will make it easier to outsource in the future (42:50)
  • About my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner and #2021sorted (05:00)

Resources

Find out more about my Getting started with Facebook ads course with Emma Van Heusen

Get on the waitlist for my 2021 Social Media Diary & Planner

Other useful podcasts

[Bonus] Should you join my Build Your Online Audience Programme? (podcast)

[358] 13 Ideas for engaging social media posts (podcast)
[366] What to post on your Facebook page to get more engagement (podcast)
[371] How to develop a Facebook page strategy (podcast)
[386] The four types of content that will help you make more sales in 2020

Connect with me on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook and LinkedIn

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